If it’s just to move troops around, why dig trenches and have a huge no-man’s-land along the road? It’s kinda like they’re building Berlin wall v2. We’ll see if they’ll allow 1.5 million displaced Gaza populations to return to the northern part of Gaza later.
By what? By who? Hamas is the de facto leadership in Gaza. It was popularly elected, and then popularly canceled all future elections. More than half the world recognizes it as a terrorist organization. It will not have its own state. Not now, not ever.
Hamas has also proven that it does not care one iota about Palestinian people or it wouldn’t have built their tunnels under people’s houses, and it would surrender and end this bloodshed.
Maybe one day the US cancels elections, then I guess it would be okay to blow you, your parents, your children, and your dog into oblivion. You probably voted for this, so you deserve to die with no dignity under piles of rubble and pain.
Since 2007, Hamas has been the de facto administration in Gaza and has ruled with an iron fist. However, Israel has never relinquished its overall control of the territory, and the UN considers Gaza still occupied. Israeli forces, in coordination with Egypt, which signed a peace treaty with Israel in 1979, have kept Gaza enclosed by land, air and sea.
People, food, fuel, internet, power and water cannot leave or enter Gaza without permission from Israel. Egypt has a land crossing in the south, Rafah, but in practice, the military regime in Cairo – an enemy of Hamas and ally with Israel’s most powerful backer, the US – acts as an enforcer of the blockade.
Israel says the blockade is for its own security, citing repeated Hamas rocket attacks and incursions. But UN experts say the blockade, and intense bombing during five wars on Gaza, amounts to collective punishment on civilians, a war crime under international law.
I disagree with the conclusions of this pro Hamas nonsense. You have all the evidence right there.
Since 2007 Hamas rules Gaza with “an iron fist.”
Ya know stoning “infidels,” assassinating Palestinians who want peace, cancelling all future elections. Nobody is going to miss Hamas when it is killed to the man. It’s a far right Islamist terrorist group and part of the much large pan Islamist movement whose motto is “death to America and death to Israel.” The singular difference between Hamas and ISIS is that they disagree as to who should be in charge of the world, Iran, the Syrian caliphate, or a new caliphate in the Levant after they literally genocide all the Jews.
And don’t bring Egypt into this.
Egypt doesn’t want terrorists using its border to smuggle weapons and fighters, either.
Food goes through. The mass starvation everyone has been warning of for five months hasn’t happened. The daily death toll is dropping like a stone.
“UN experts”
may sound authoritative and conclusive to you but I went to school with some of these people and know how shitty they are with facts and reasoning when they get emotional, which is what Hamas counts on. They should surrender. Period.
There won’t be a lasting ceasefire until it stops fighting and by fighting I of course mean targeting Jewish civilians and using Gaza and everyone in it as its personal suit of armor.
All this shit you have to say about the evil Jewish empire is only to say that Israel must stop defending itself. That’s why for all your links you cannot give a rational explanation for Hamas’s plan on October 7 that didn’t end in a massive civilian death toll. 30,000 is awful but Hamas decided with the consent of Gaza to put every one of them in harms way and then rolled the dice with their lives.
If you stopped constantly dehumanizing palestinians for a second, maybe you’d recognize Hamas began due to the terrible material conditions of Occupation, and has the goal of ending the occupation. Maybe you’d even recognize collective punishment has been a deliberate Israeli tactic for decades with the Dahiya doctrine. Hamas is very different from ISIS, but they both were born out of Terrorism from Israel and the US respectively. Hamas wants an end to the Apartheid, not genocide. That claim is both untrue, and holds no weight when Israel is currently engaging in genocide. This is about the state of Israel being founded on ethnic cleansing and it’s most recent ethnic cleansing campaign. Not Jewish people, stop being antisemitic by thinking they’re the same.
Hamas in its early days, according to former Israeli officials, was seen by the government of Israel as a counterweight to the PLO. Israel supported Hamas as a way to break the PLO’s hold on the region. Retired official Avner Cohen, who worked in Gaza in the 1990s and oversaw religious affairs in the region, told the WSJ in 2009, “Hamas, to my great regret, is Israel’s creation."
In the 2006 election, Ismail Haniyeh led Hamas as the head of Hamas’ parliamentary bloc, while the president of the Palestinian Authority (PA), Mahmoud Abbas, led Fatah, as well as the PLO and Palestinian National Authority (PNA). (Haniyeh is now chairman of Hamas’ political bureau, and Abbas remains in his positions, as of this writing.) With Haniyeh at the helm, Hamas won around 44% of the votes across the region, according to a 2006 ABC News report, a total that secured a majority of seats in the legislature under election rules.
And in the backdrop of the 2006 election were geographic and political divides between Gaza and the West Bank. Contrary to what Bennett claimed, Israel restricted Palestinians from moving in and out of Gaza, as well as between the strip and the West Bank, since at least the 1990s, after the first Palestinian Intifada, or uprising, according to Al Jazeera. In addition to Gaza’s borders, the Israeli government controlled its coastline and airspace, allowing for military incursions into the territory, and, in 2007, established the blockade on goods and people that still exists as of this writing.
Pan-Islamism and Pan-Arabism were both movements born out of anti-colonialism and opposed western political involvement, but they are not the same and have different history. There is no monolith in the middle east. Neither a Muslim nor an Arab Monolith. If you think all Muslims or all Arab people think the same you’re just being racist.
Hamas, while associated with the Muslim Brotherhood in the past, is not the same as the Muslim Brotherhood.
When Israel occupied the Palestinian territories in 1967, the Muslim Brotherhood members there did not take active part in the resistance, preferring to focus on social-religious reform and on restoring Islamic values. This outlook changed in the early 1980s, and Islamic organizations became more involved in Palestinian politics. The driving force behind this transformation was Sheikh Ahmed Yassin, a Palestinian refugee from Al-Jura. Of humble origins and quadriplegic, he became one of the Muslim Brotherhood’s leaders in Gaza. His charisma and conviction brought him a loyal group of followers, upon whom he depended for everything from feeding him and transporting him to and from events to communicating his strategy to the public. In 1973, Yassin founded the social-religious charity Mujama al-Islamiya (“Islamic center”) in Gaza as an offshoot of the Muslim Brotherhood.
The idea of Hamas began to take form on December 10, 1987, when several members of the Brotherhood convened the day after an incident in which an Israeli army truck crashed into a car at a Gaza checkpoint, killing four Palestinian day-workers, the impetus of the First Intifada. The group met at Yassin’s house to strategize on how to maximize the incident’s impact in spreading nationalist sentiments and sparking public demonstrations. A leaflet issued on December 14 calling for resistance is considered its first public intervention, though the name Hamas itself was not used until January 1988
To many Palestinians, Hamas represented a more authentic engagement with their national aspirations. This perception arose because Hamas offered an Islamic interpretation of the original goals of the secular PLO, focusing on armed struggle to liberate all of Palestine. This approach contrasted with the PLO’s eventual acceptance of territorial compromise, which involved settling for a smaller portion of Mandatory Palestine. Hamas’s formal establishment came a month after the PLO and other intifada leaders issued a 14-point declaration in January 1988 advocating for the coexistence of a Palestinian state alongside Israel.
Okay we agree on that. You break it you buy it, as solid rationale as any. I think they not only pay but also have to administer the reconstruction, and that in addition to the work of rebuilding Gaza’s physical structures and infrastructure, Israel must rebuild the institutions of Gaza, free of Hamas corruption and Iranian influence.
The IDF, that very reliable source (/S), says they’ll only use it to move troops around.
One very easy tell that the IDF is lying: their lips are moving.
That’s very true. The other way you can be sure they are lying is that they are conservatives.
If it’s just to move troops around, why dig trenches and have a huge no-man’s-land along the road? It’s kinda like they’re building Berlin wall v2. We’ll see if they’ll allow 1.5 million displaced Gaza populations to return to the northern part of Gaza later.
Why wait and see when you can just take their word at face value? They won’t.
https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/israeli-minister-calls-voluntary-emigration-gazans-2023-11-14/
Yeah and it shouldn’t. Gaza is a lawless place. There is no legitimate government there. Somebody has to rebuild it. Who’s going to do it?
Palestinians?
The hubris and condescension from you people. Maniacal.
By what? By who? Hamas is the de facto leadership in Gaza. It was popularly elected, and then popularly canceled all future elections. More than half the world recognizes it as a terrorist organization. It will not have its own state. Not now, not ever.
Hamas has also proven that it does not care one iota about Palestinian people or it wouldn’t have built their tunnels under people’s houses, and it would surrender and end this bloodshed.
Maybe one day the US cancels elections, then I guess it would be okay to blow you, your parents, your children, and your dog into oblivion. You probably voted for this, so you deserve to die with no dignity under piles of rubble and pain.
You can’t imagine how ashamed of yourself you will be when you realize what kind of genocide you were cheering for all day and night.
Impossible. Conservatives are not capable of shame.
I think this person is a Democrat, which imo makes it even worse.
I’m a left wing two-time Bernie alum but thanks.
Just wasn’t born yesterday and recognize Hamas for what it is.
I literally have the same position as most of the democratic party.
Gaza is under control by Israel’s Blockade
I disagree with the conclusions of this pro Hamas nonsense. You have all the evidence right there.
Ya know stoning “infidels,” assassinating Palestinians who want peace, cancelling all future elections. Nobody is going to miss Hamas when it is killed to the man. It’s a far right Islamist terrorist group and part of the much large pan Islamist movement whose motto is “death to America and death to Israel.” The singular difference between Hamas and ISIS is that they disagree as to who should be in charge of the world, Iran, the Syrian caliphate, or a new caliphate in the Levant after they literally genocide all the Jews.
And don’t bring Egypt into this.
Food goes through. The mass starvation everyone has been warning of for five months hasn’t happened. The daily death toll is dropping like a stone.
may sound authoritative and conclusive to you but I went to school with some of these people and know how shitty they are with facts and reasoning when they get emotional, which is what Hamas counts on. They should surrender. Period.
There won’t be a lasting ceasefire until it stops fighting and by fighting I of course mean targeting Jewish civilians and using Gaza and everyone in it as its personal suit of armor.
All this shit you have to say about the evil Jewish empire is only to say that Israel must stop defending itself. That’s why for all your links you cannot give a rational explanation for Hamas’s plan on October 7 that didn’t end in a massive civilian death toll. 30,000 is awful but Hamas decided with the consent of Gaza to put every one of them in harms way and then rolled the dice with their lives.
I love reading this BS. Hamas sucks but they don’t stone people. Why do you feel the need to make shit up?
If you stopped constantly dehumanizing palestinians for a second, maybe you’d recognize Hamas began due to the terrible material conditions of Occupation, and has the goal of ending the occupation. Maybe you’d even recognize collective punishment has been a deliberate Israeli tactic for decades with the Dahiya doctrine. Hamas is very different from ISIS, but they both were born out of Terrorism from Israel and the US respectively. Hamas wants an end to the Apartheid, not genocide. That claim is both untrue, and holds no weight when Israel is currently engaging in genocide. This is about the state of Israel being founded on ethnic cleansing and it’s most recent ethnic cleansing campaign. Not Jewish people, stop being antisemitic by thinking they’re the same.
People Claim a Majority of Palestinians in Gaza Elected Hamas — Here’s Why It Isn’t That Simple
Hamas founding charter and Revised charter 2017
Hamas was born out of pan Islamism. Israel didn’t invent it. It’s hundreds of years old.
Pan-Islamism and Pan-Arabism were both movements born out of anti-colonialism and opposed western political involvement, but they are not the same and have different history. There is no monolith in the middle east. Neither a Muslim nor an Arab Monolith. If you think all Muslims or all Arab people think the same you’re just being racist.
Hamas, while associated with the Muslim Brotherhood in the past, is not the same as the Muslim Brotherhood.
Not the fucking Israelis.
They expect everyone else to fix what they broke and protect them, while they mouth the hands that feed.
How long would they last without big daddy USA?
Okay then who?
Who what?
Edit: Nvm, I thought this was another conversation.
Israel should pay obviously.
They broke, they pay.
Okay we agree on that. You break it you buy it, as solid rationale as any. I think they not only pay but also have to administer the reconstruction, and that in addition to the work of rebuilding Gaza’s physical structures and infrastructure, Israel must rebuild the institutions of Gaza, free of Hamas corruption and Iranian influence.
And Israeli influence
Well if the road is only for troops then I suppose any Israeli on it will be a legitimate target moving forward.
Well attacks on the military (troops and installations) have been described as terrorism, so there’s that too.