I’m not really in those circles but I feel like the timeline is wrong here. I don’t think young men see these figures, then venture out parroting them and crash their metaphorical bicycle. I think the bicycle crash is what makes them seek out that content. Maybe that’s how it’s working with very young men who are just now starting to talk to girls, idk.
The problem from where I stand is that conventional advice on how to get attention from women doesn’t work like it used to. Young men are entering the world and finding that they’re just not as attractive as their mothers have been telling them their whole life, and setting yourself up to have a decent income isn’t the selling point that the older generation told us it was.
So you either focus on other areas of your life and maybe you happen into some kind of relationship, or you look to adapt to this world of dating apps and hook-ups and you probably end up unsatisfied for a number of reasons, and that’s when someone turns to the manosphere.
I actually don’t think there’s any “crash”, they’re just being sold a false idea of masculinity from the jump. They’re unhappy because they’re told (and shown through cultural male representation) that healthy men are satyric and dominant and are encouraged to seek sexual satisfaction over seeking emotional satisfaction, and then get frustrated when the object of their sexual desire rejects them in favor of emotional satisfaction over the sexual.
I think Joe Rogan fits into that genre because he very much views masculinity through a naturalistic lense, even if he isn’t advocating for toxic male behavior as explicitly as Tate or fresh and fit.
Getting attention from women shouldn’t be the goal at all, it should be forming satisfying emotional connections, and that is something men are simply not taught.
As a guy who luckily only had to deal with the shitty realm of PUA in the early 2000s, I will say that typically it’s not a bike crash that gets you in the road. It’s more like you stumble across some con man who says he can “pick up any girl he wants and he’ll show you how!” So being a young impressionable male you try the advice and it usually doesn’t work. That leads (me at least) down the path of misogyny and “nice-guy ness” (I’m very sorry, I’m better now), and bada boom you’ve got yourself a roganite.
I’m not really in those circles but I feel like the timeline is wrong here. I don’t think young men see these figures, then venture out parroting them and crash their metaphorical bicycle. I think the bicycle crash is what makes them seek out that content. Maybe that’s how it’s working with very young men who are just now starting to talk to girls, idk.
The problem from where I stand is that conventional advice on how to get attention from women doesn’t work like it used to. Young men are entering the world and finding that they’re just not as attractive as their mothers have been telling them their whole life, and setting yourself up to have a decent income isn’t the selling point that the older generation told us it was.
So you either focus on other areas of your life and maybe you happen into some kind of relationship, or you look to adapt to this world of dating apps and hook-ups and you probably end up unsatisfied for a number of reasons, and that’s when someone turns to the manosphere.
I actually don’t think there’s any “crash”, they’re just being sold a false idea of masculinity from the jump. They’re unhappy because they’re told (and shown through cultural male representation) that healthy men are satyric and dominant and are encouraged to seek sexual satisfaction over seeking emotional satisfaction, and then get frustrated when the object of their sexual desire rejects them in favor of emotional satisfaction over the sexual.
I think Joe Rogan fits into that genre because he very much views masculinity through a naturalistic lense, even if he isn’t advocating for toxic male behavior as explicitly as Tate or fresh and fit.
Getting attention from women shouldn’t be the goal at all, it should be forming satisfying emotional connections, and that is something men are simply not taught.
As a guy who luckily only had to deal with the shitty realm of PUA in the early 2000s, I will say that typically it’s not a bike crash that gets you in the road. It’s more like you stumble across some con man who says he can “pick up any girl he wants and he’ll show you how!” So being a young impressionable male you try the advice and it usually doesn’t work. That leads (me at least) down the path of misogyny and “nice-guy ness” (I’m very sorry, I’m better now), and bada boom you’ve got yourself a roganite.