- cross-posted to:
- news@beehaw.org
- cross-posted to:
- news@beehaw.org
President Biden and other senior U.S. officials are becoming increasingly frustrated with Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and his rejection of most of the administration’s recent requests related to the war in Gaza, four U.S. officials with direct knowledge of the issue told Axios.
Why it matters: Since the Oct. 7 Hamas attack 100 days ago, Biden has given Israel his full backing, with unprecedented military and diplomatic support, even while taking a political hit from part of his base in an election year. That support has largely continued publicly, but behind the scenes, there are growing signs that Biden is losing his patience, the U.S. officials said.
- “The situation sucks and we are stuck. The president’s patience is running out,” one U.S. official told Axios.
- “At every juncture, Netanyahu has given Biden the finger,” Sen. Chris Van Hollen (D-Md.), who has been in close contact with U.S. officials about the war, told Axios. “They are pleading with the Netanyahu coalition, but getting slapped in the face over and over again.”
Behind the scenes: Biden hasn’t spoken to Netanyahu in the 20 days since a tense Dec. 23 call, which a frustrated Biden ended with the words: “This conversation is over.” They had spoken almost every other day in the first two months of the war.
- Before Biden hung up, Netanyahu had rejected his request that Israel release the Palestinian tax revenues it’s withholding.
- National Security Council spokesperson John Kirby tried to downplay the decrease in communication, telling reporters on Wednesday that “it doesn’t say anything” about the state of the relationship.
- But more and more signs of irritation are emerging. “There is immense frustration,” a U.S. official said.
0.004% of all Palestinian have been killed. 1% of the Palestinians in Gaza. Daily death tolls have been falling.
What evidence is there of genocide?
It sounds like you are complaining the genocide isn’t going fast enough.
No I’m saying these numbers are proof positive that s genocide is not taking place. The daily numbers are going down with 99.996% of the Palestinian population still alive. What kind of genocide is that?
Good thing genocides aren’t declared over percentages, but hard numbers. Over 20,000 innocent Palestinians have been murdered by the IDF. Genocides start at 5000.
What? It’s not a question of numbers but a question of intent. I’m saying the numbers as they stand are not evidence of such intent.
If the daily numbers of people dying was going up instead of down, such numbers would tend to prove genocidal intent.
Maybe it’s 5,000 people if the total number of people is 25,000 or something. That would be 20%. That would tend to prove genocidal intent.
Other things I would consider strong evidence: air strikes on civilian targets without no credible military justification, precision, or proportionality, would tend to prove genocidal intent.
Israel is literally doing all of what you have described in your last paragraph, go see a therapist because you have lost all empathy
You got tricked. The IDF has been pretty transparent. Link me a specific example of what you’re talking about and maybe I can help you understand how you’ve gotten mixed up.
Forget it, Lemmy is hell bend that Israel is the new Nazi-Area Germany. I agree with you that there is no genocide. There are lot’s of war crimes, but no genocide.
Fuck off to Truth Social then, propaganda bot. 20,000 dead innocent Palestinians, mostly women and children, referred to as sub-human animals by the Israelis, bUt No GeNoCiDe HeRe!
Yeah, never heard “sub-human animals” in regards to Palestinians from Israelis in the last 20 years. Only in regards to Hamas and I tend to agree with that notion.
These people got tricked and they cannot believe evidence before their eyes.
This is the equivalent to thinking someone is going to win a marathon if they are limping and have slowed to a walk after 400 feet.
There were 150 times more Iraqi civilians killed per capita in the US war in Iraq and I have never once heard a single person call it a genocide.
Israel has the ability to level Gaza and the West Bank and kill every Palestinian person within about twenty minutes and yet they have not done so.
Instead, were three months into this “genocide” and 99.996% of the Palestinian people are still there.
It seems to me that Israel is targeting the tunnel infrastructure im Gaza City and known Hamas militants, who use their families and public infrastructure including school, hospitals, and apartment building to conceal the 800 tunnel shafts the IDF have documented in Gaza City.
Also, some 90% of the airstrikes have been in a tiny area of Gaza City, at the tunnels from which Hamas launched the October 7 attach and to which they retreated. Israel issued emergency text and OTA broadcasts warning civilians to evacuate and not to go near the blockade. I’ll agree the blockade and occupation were illegal, but Gaza no has has now functional ability to govern itself, let alone rebuild the infrastructure.
Thankfully the UN and Geneva Convention don’t require us to wait for the oppressed population to be dead to declare a genocide. What Israel is doing meets the definition.
What are you going to do when South Africa’s complaint gets thrown out kn the papers?
Shrug. The world pretty much expects that the court is there for enemies of the Western countries anyways. I’ll be happy if they rule against Israel but not surprised if they don’t.
What will you do when it doesn’t?
Read the decision and factual allegations, the tribunal’s statement of the law, and it’s analysis, and figure out what information I lack right now that would have informed a more accurate assessment. That’s what I do when I’m wrong about a case.
ok buddy. I’m just going to believe your made up numbers. But it’s ok, keep sucking that Israeli cock.
If you don’t know where these numbers came from you don’t know enough about this to have opinions. Kindly stop posting about this.
they came from your mouth. you’re the one that didn’t post your source. you expect everyone to just take your word for it? yeah no. not trusting some rando online that supports what israel is doing. killing women and children indiscriminately is indefensible and if you try you’re just as bit of a piece of shit as the zionists that are attempting to wipe a group of people from the face of the earth.
Again if you think I just made them up, were not aware of them yourself, and have no idea about how they are tabulated, then I don’t believe that you’ve been following along closely enough to really have strong opinions about what’s happening.
Indiscriminate killing? That’s bogus. The IDF told civilians to leave. Hamas used human shields. You can criticize Israel for being overzealous with collateral deaths, but saying they are indiscriminate is just not true. Surprise surprise you don’t know basic facts about the war and you got tricked by a lie.
They were told to leave, and then prevented from leaving through the only crossing at Rafah. Then the refugee camps at Rafah were bombed.
Egypt controls the southern border. Humanitarian corridors were respected with a handful of exceptions. 70 deaths are attributed to such attacks.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attacks_on_Palestinians_evacuating_Gaza_City
I have not reviewed each one and compared it to what IDF says on its official website.
I’m not finding much info for an airstrike on Rafah. It’s. Not on this page, which is well edited:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_engagements_during_the_2023_Israel–Hamas_war
So you’re ok with a military killing innocents. I got it. You flat refuse to share your sources. Got it. “do your own research”. Got it. You realize that any credible news outlet, be it a paper, tv show, web site etc will tell their sources. Because that’s how you’re credible. You’re just a dude on the internet. How do I know you’re not getting your number from a bogus ‘source’? Just “trust me bro”. The IDF told people to leave, then bombed the places they told people to go. Ok, Hamas used human shields. Just shoot through the shield. Great. You killed two birds with one stone. The IDF WANTS all those people dead, why would they be discriminate when choosing targets? Bomb them all. The IDF called Palestinians “vermin”, sure sounds like someone who cares about human life to me. The IDF is doing exactly what the Israeli government has wanted to do for years and they used a false flag to justify doing it. 100 days dude. ONE HUNDRED DAYS of bombing for “retaliation” for something so small, and has plenty of evidence that was orchestrated BY the Israeli government. Hell HAMAS WAS CREATED BY ISRAEL in the first place. If the IDF is such a great military, why do they need to bomb civilian buildings, refugee centers, caravans? why not tactically go in, take out Hamas leadership and protect the innocent people? Ah, yes, that’s because they are INDESCRIMINATE with their killing because they want ALL PALISTINIANS dead. Remember this. Remember how you defended baby killers. Remember how you defended woman killers. There will come a time when you decide to backtrack on your stance, but I want you to remember that you defended this attempted genocide. Hamas is evil, I will give you that. But the Palestinian people should not pay for that with their lives.
You have some homework to do, kid.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_engagements_during_the_2023_Israel–Hamas_war
LOL. that’s some complete information to base your entire belief system on there. Write back when there is some information that isn’t just “???”
Oh I see. Wikipedia is a good starting point when you’re unfamiliar with a topic. That’s just where I recommend you get started if you actually want to talk about any of these things
I agree with most of this.
But if they wanted all Palestinians dead, they could do it within a half a day at most.
I haven’t looked into every allegation and it certainly seems like some war crimes have been committed by IDF soldiers. That’s a very far stretch from a formal policy of genocide, which is incredible because the death tolls and air strikes are decreasing with 99.996% of Palestinian people unharmed.
I was reading about an airstrike on a refugee camp; IDF says there was a tunnel under a market from which a Hamas leader was holed up and that the airstrike killed him and some other top Hamas people; if that’s not true, it’s a war crime. In another, the IDF struck four mosques at a refugee camp and it says the strikes killed 150 Hamas fighters who holed up in the mosques along with a bunch of civilians that Hamas held there against their will. The ministry in Gaza says there were 400 people killed. Doctors Without Borders says there were 50 civilians killed.
Innocent women and children dying in a war zone does not make it a genocide. A few statements from extremist politicians outside the military chain of command or which do not match the facts on the ground does not make it a genocide.
Calling Palestinians vermin and then trying to kill every Palestinian would be a genocide. That’s what genocide means: the intent to kill all of a people. I have yet to hear a coherent argument, just screeching and emotional nonsense.
I’m okay with the military targeting tunnels and Hamas members; those are just and moral targets. It’s sad and unfortunate that Hamas hid the tunnel shafts (800 shafts found so far) in hospitals, schools, and apartment buildings, and that it seems like a lot of people didn’t evacuate when they should have. And it’s unfortunate that Hamas members force their families, those innocent women and children, to accompany them and prevent them from leaving. Why don’t they insist that they flea while the soldiers stay to fight, if the want. Seems like Hamas wants their families and neighbors to be martyred for sympathy.
In the wake of October 7, Israel isn’t waiting to get these targets alone.
In 2025, there will be more Palestinians on earth than there were in 2023.
That’s the reality of this situation.
That doesn’t mean a genocide isn’t happening. A net decrease in population isn’t the criteria to announce that genocide is occurring. Just the total number of dead.
So what’s the number? I’ve never seen a genocide defined by a number but teach me something today. From a demographic perspective, this isn’t 1% of Palestinians. Syria has well over a half million dead in their conflict, not seeing people lining up calling that a genocide. There were around a million dead as a result of the Iraq war, was that a genocide?
Genocide is about intent as much as numbers, there are millions of Arabs living in Israel with rights and privileges that clearly show the intent is not genocidal.
FactBased and jew pilled